Transcript

[00:00:00] Multiple Voices: Fundraising everywhere. Fundraising everywhere. Fundraising everywhere. Fundraising everywhere. Fundraising everywhere. Fundraising everywhere. Fundraising everywhere. Fundraising everywhere. Fundraising everywhere. Fundraising everywhere. Fundraising everywhere. Fundraising everywhere. Fundraising everywhere. Fundraising everywhere. Fundraising everywhere. Fundraising everywhere. Fundraising everywhere. Fundraising everywhere. , you don’t need to add me in there.

[00:00:31] Jade Cunnah: Welcome to the Fundraising Everywhere podcast. Your go-to place for fundraising tips and inspiration. Love what you hear. Get more insights straight to your inbox. Subscribe to our email list for exclusive fundraising resources, early access to training, special discounts, and more. Just head on over to fundraising everwhere.com/podcast to subscribe Now onto today’s episode, enjoy.

00:00:59] Simon Scriver: It is I, a few people have said to me in the past, I like to say this, but that cringe is good, especially in fundraising. Like when things are a bit cheesy, when things are a bit cringey, it seems to make people, I dunno, a bit more open to things or a bit more, I dunno, what do you think? Do you like cringe?

[00:01:10] Alin Dinu: I, I don’t like, and I, I don’t like it. And I think it’s particularly uncomfortable, but it, in a way, it’s a process of growth if framed in the right way. So I’m just, it’s in a way, a little bit like going to the gym. I don’t like necessarily going to the gym, but it feels good afterwards.

[00:01:34] Simon Scriver: That’s good. I like that On, on that note.

[00:01:37] Simon Scriver: Let’s start officially, let’s kick off the Fundraising Everywhere podcast. Hello everyone. You’re all very welcome. Uh, my name is Simon Scriver. I am one of the co-founders of Fundraising Everywhere. Um, and I’m speaking to you today. Perhaps you’re watching Live on LinkedIn. If you’re watching Live on LinkedIn, then do feel free to put in a comment, say hello, throw in your questions, throw, throw in your own thoughts as we get this going.

[00:01:57] Simon Scriver: Um, or perhaps you’re listening back on the Fundraising Everywhere podcast. And if you’re listening back to Fundraising Everywhere podcast, then you’re very welcome. Thank you for joining us. Make sure you do subscribe. And do check out everything that’s going on@fundraisingeverywhere.com. Uh, we are coming into the big month of really face-to-face and telephone fundraising.

[00:02:14] Simon Scriver: We seem to be all about face-to-face and telephone fundraising in April. Um, and in particular, we have our face-to-face fundraising conference, which is happening virtually on the 23rd of April. If you haven’t got your tickets for that, you should find a link around here somewhere in the description or go to fundraising everywhere.com.

[00:02:29] Simon Scriver: But we’ll be talking about All Face. Things face-to-face. And then myself and Nikki, we will be heading over to the amazing face-to-face fundraise, international Fundraising Congress, uh, which is happening in Vienna, where I am looking forward to meeting my guest. Face-to-face. Face-to-face at the face-to-face.

[00:02:45] Simon Scriver: Uh, ladies and gentlemen, my guest today is Alan Denu, uh, who, I mean, you are a face-to-face, so you’re all passionate about face-to-face. But Alin, you’re very welcome. Who are you?

[00:02:50] Alin Dinu Hey Simon. Thank you
very much. So my name’s Alan Dinu. Uh, I wake up in the morning in order to inspire people to communicate better so we can feel the world, so we can, uh, build the world filled with nourishing relationship.
The relationships I’ve been into face-to-face since 2016. I started to save the children. It was kind of a little bit of synchronicity. Uh, we found each other on the streets. I, or I was organizing some, uh, events, uh, back then motivational events with this charity that I started, and we kind of fell in love with one another.
They liked my services. Then they found, they found it useful. They invited me to work and that’s where it all started. I just, I just wanna say that, uh, I, uh, I’m gonna buy three tickets for your Congress on the, for your conference on the 23rd of April. And I’m looking forward to meeting you, Nikki, Danny, and, uh, sbe and yeah.

[00:03:51] Simon Scriver: Yeah, I made it. That’s great. Social proof for anyone watching. If, if, if Alan’s buying a ticket, then you surely must buy a ticket. So you got into face to face. You were recruited on the street, like that’s how you. Kind of discovered this career that is face-to-face fundraising is, is from a face-to-face person themselves.
Uh, in a way I was, uh, shifting careers from sales and I was working in like life insurance, life insurances, and I was selling industry products like electrodes, welding wires, stuff like that. And I wasn’t really satisfied because something was missing. And what was missing was exactly the part of, Hey, where’s the contribution part?
I wanna do my part. I wanna, you know, we make the world a better place. Anyway. And one thing, one thing led to another, I started the charity called Anything Is Possible in Romania. It’s called Totally Possible. So anything is possible where we’re supporting. Um. Like, uh, sports people who didn’t have material means, but they were really talented and we were, we were organizing these events where we would, they were all based on mindset.
So, uh, I was searching for charities where I could just offer services, like these mindset services, motivational trainings, and so on. And one day as I was walking down the street, I met the Save the Children fundraise face-to-face team. I just stopped and I said hi, and they invited me to speak with their coordinator, which was this girl back then called Carmen.
Then I invited them to one of my events, and then they just said, Hey, like maybe you want to start working a little bit with our face-to-face team. And I said yes. I, I, I had just learned social dynamics, like it was fresh in my head and like in my bones in a way. And all that I learned from social dynamics was practically almost what face-to-face fundraisers were doing on the streets.
Mm. So we were a perfect match. When I came on board in 2016, there were, I think five people there, four team leaders and one fundraiser. They were having challenges of, uh, recruiting people, but holding them. And one year later when I left, there were, there were about 50 people in the, like nationwide. Wow.
And the team had Korea. Amazingly, in this process, I really fell in love. I mean, I discovered not only that, uh, it’s uh, an industry that I like, but also something that I’m good at. And because it practically makes the world a better place, it’s kind of, I mean, not kind of, it’s my iki guy.

[00:06:20] Simon Scriver: I, I mean, so your role, role now, I mean, what you’ve grown into essentially is you are a co a co.

[00:06:26] Simon Scriver: I mean, you seem to be, have, there’s a number of words that describe what you do, but coaching is a pretty good sense. You are coaching face-to-face fundraisers under your company now, uh, DDO, uh, DDO. And you, you guys basically train up and help people get that mindset, get into a space where they become better face-to-face fundraisers.

[00:06:44] Simon Scriver: Is that what you’re doing? Definitely,
and we’re not only working with fundraisers, but we’re working with leaders and managers as well. Mm-hmm. Uh, practically what we’re doing is every organization and charity, uh, I mean charity and the agency, they, you have as a charity and, uh, NGO, uh, I mean, you have performance goals and in order to achieve these performance goals, you need a few things, but alongside performance, something which is very important is culture.
So you have these two things, culture and performance. So performance is, in my mind, look, looking at it very simplistically, it is about goals. You need to know where you’re going. It’s about mindset. Definitely you need a good mindset in order, in order to achieve those goals. And you need skills like fundraising skills, how to stop people, how to pitch, how to handle objections, or as a manager.
Or leader, how to have one-on-ones, how to facilitate meetings, how to solve conflicts and other stuff like that. So this is the performance side, but also if you’re focusing only on performance, I discovered that it doesn’t really work. I mean it works, but your, the turnover is high and is frustrating and the costs are very high, especially recruitment, recruitment costs.
So we’re also supporting organizations in developing healthy cultures, which is based, like has a basis on values. And healthy relationships. So Jules and I were very complimentary because he’s, he’s, uh, focused on performance and skills and mindset. And my side is how to coach people, how to coach organizations, really developing and strengthening cultures where fundraisers and leaders come to work.
The ideal is with joy and enthusiasm, but at least not to come, like, I have to go to work. No. Like, I wanna go to work.

[00:08:35] Simon Scriver: Mm, there. Do you find there’s a strange clash in, um, in charities because often charities, they, to me, they almost feel like two, two organizations. Sometimes you’ve always got the kind of charitable side of it, but then you’ve got the fundraising side of it, which often feels like it’s, it’s very much its own thing, you know?

[00:08:52] Simon Scriver: And you often hear about rest of an organization clashing with fundraising or almost being embarrassed of fundraising. And especially with face-to-face. We see that worldwide sometimes, like organizations are. Struggle. They struggle to like welcome in their face-to-face and things like this. So when you look, when you see the culture in there, do you see a conflict of cultures between these or how do you manage that, that work you do with fundraising culture plus the culture of being a charitable organization?

[00:09:21] Simon Scriver: Is there a conflict there or is it, does it just work for you?

[00:09:27] Simon Scriver: Okay.
Nice one. So one thing, we’ve been working mostly with face-to-face teams. So on this side, the face-to-face teams are a little bit separate than the The whole organizations. Yeah.

[00:09:43] Simon Scriver: Yeah.
So we’re supporting face-to-face teams to really strengthen their cultures and develop. Uh, healthy relationships so that it’s easy for you to come to work with joy and develop, and then, uh, also achieve your goals.
Step stepping a little, uh, stepping a few steps like, uh, back. Um, yeah, I’ve noticed I. Quite a few times that there’s a little bit of tension between the face-to-face, um, department and the other, uh, departments. But this is happening only when the leaders of the organization don’t know or don’t understand what face-to-face fundraising really is and how valuable it is to the health of the organization.
Yeah. So for. Uh, uh, I worked with this organization that the leader, the, uh, the director, he used to be very connected to the face-to-face industry, so like having this understanding. He was very much well paying, he’s very much welcoming. The, the fundraisers in the whole of the, like the whole of the organization.

[00:10:50] Simon Scriver: Yeah. Yeah. How, how can you, if you are dealing with, um, you know, the people you deal with, you deal, you work with people on all levels, so like junior people who are kind of even on the street now up to management levels. How do you, how do you work with someone if they aren’t supported by that culture around them?

[00:11:09] Simon Scriver: Because I imagine that’s one of the biggest challenges you have is like, you can change and work with people as much as you want, but if they’re in a, in a difficult environment or an environment that doesn’t support their fundraising goals. How do you kind of approach that with them? Do, do they, do you tell ’em to just escape or how can you start to like manage it from within?

[00:11:29] Simon Scriver: So,
uh, yeah, so these are, there are a few nuances here. I think the simplest answer there is, is. Organizations that come to us, they’re in a process of of development. So this process of development means also training. Training doesn’t really work without executive coaching. So in order to change the team culture or the organization culture, we really need, we really need to start from the top, like from the head

[00:11:59] Simon Scriver: it.
So if I’m working with the head of the organization, then, then that’s simpler. I, I mean, they can’t, they can’t go anywhere and their goals are usually. Uh, ES escalated, not escalated. They, they’re the goals of the organization. Yeah. Very tid. Very strongly. Exactly. Exactly. So if I’m working with someone, let’s say underneath that they have issues or challenges in the culture, I.
Like ethically, I just support them achieve their goals. Really, as a coach, this, this means I’m, uh, orienting you, orienting you as my client to really achieve whatever you desire. Mm-hmm. So sometimes, yeah, this means not necessarily encouraging because I’m not encouraging my, my clients are the experts of their lives.
I’m just, just being present with their process and sometimes asking some questions or clarifying some stuff that they say or they want to achieve. Hmm.

[00:12:53] Simon Scriver: What, what do, what do they, I mean these, because you work with a big range of clients, like what, what do they often miss? Do you know, because you, because like you say, it’s, they have the answers within them.

[00:13:02] Simon Scriver: They know themselves best, and you are just kind of drawing that out of them. What have people usually not considered or what’s holding people back from, from achieving these goals that you’re helping them work towards?
I think most often than not, it’s. A place where they feel comfortable and a place where they feel free to express themselves authentically.
So they’re missing confidence and safety. Mm. If you have like, um, yeah. If you have a place where it’s comfortable for you to express yourself authentically and you enjoy coming there, most often than not, you’ll start moving to. Exploring your potential rather than if it’s a place where you have to go there, you are not let paid enough.
Uh, the boss or the manager or the leader always presses you, you know, Hey, you haven’t done that, you haven’t done that. It’s always about the results that you, what you haven’t done. Then there’s, I’ve seen that there’s no real place of, Hey, who am I in this process? What do I bring to the table?

[00:14:08] Simon Scriver: Ha.

[00:14:11] Simon Scriver: Why is that? Is it, is it a fear? It’s a fear from leadership. It’s a fear from leadership of losing control or of thing. You know, I mean, is it the same symptom we see in face-to-face where people are afraid of what’s being said on the street instead of letting their face-to-face be themselves? And, and I agree with you like very often, like as, as you let people.

[00:14:34] Simon Scriver: Have creative control and let people be themselves, like the results shine through. But how do you balance that with the leadership who you know that, especially the old school, you know, the old fashioned kind of organizations who’ve been there a while or someone’s been in the role for, they hold onto these things and they don’t want to allow that breathing space is, I mean, is that something that can be changed in a culture or are you doomed if you have that around you?
Are we speaking about people who would like to change and understand the consequences of a healthy culture? Or are we, are we speaking about giants, uh, dinosaurs who are just waiting to, let’s say, just move on?

[00:15:11] Simon Scriver: It’s interesting, I dunno, because I mean, if you ask any of these people, they’ll all say they’re open to change and we embrace change and, you know, we are looking to the future and things like this.

[00:15:23] Simon Scriver: We, we’ve read the mission and the vision and the values of all these organizations. Like they’re all saying they embrace the future. But when you think about the star, the people who are listening to this, like I, I would, I would be willing to bet there’s more than a handful who are working in organizations where they feel they have no, no freedom, no freedom.
And it’s sad when this happens.
So, again, some nuances here. If I’m looking from a, from the perspective of the person, like let’s say this quote unquote dinosaur, right? A person who they think they know better. They, they have this, they have, maybe they have, they’ve had, they’ve had a few good results in the past. But times have changed and they haven’t changed to keep up with the new times.
Right? What’s new now? And they’re not willing to adapt or to be flexible or to just improve a little bit, like communication wise, maybe some skills, leadership skills, management skills, whatever it’s needed for that project. Uh, if I was managing this person. I would take every situation by hand. So if he was working for me, let’s say I’m the, the senior manager, and they would be the mid, uh, mid-level manager, I would just delegate and I would just, what’s the word?
Um, set healthy boundaries.

[00:16:57] Simon Scriver: Mm-hmm.
I wouldn’t allow this type of people that much freedom. So this is what you need to do. You need to do it this way in order for fundraisers or in order to create a healthy culture. Healthy culture. What’s happening when they’re the boss, right? When they’re the manager and you know, I’m stuck in a place where I don’t want to be.
Well, that really depends on you if I was there. I really appreciate freedom and I really appreciate, appreciate creativity and being able to express myself. I would probably search for something else, but, but, but before searching for something else, I, I would make sure that I give my best. I mean, 1, 1, 1 thing here that, you know, Jules is, uh, really teaching very well is mindset.
And one of the, uh, things about mindset is how to change your state. So one criteria of change criteria, uh, or tool to change your, your state is in, uh, inner dialogue, which practically is reframing. So let’s say, you know, my boss is really like, is really cutting me short. Hey Alin, you haven’t done that.
You haven’t done this, this, you’re behind on that thing, whatever. Like, uh, not allowing me any breathing time. So if I’m really dedicated and I’m like, and my way of growing, uh, I might ask myself from time to time, how is this situation the best teacher for me right now? How is this? Think how is the situation or the relationship helping me achieve my goals or become the person that I want to become?
Mm. And sometimes I’m changing, and in the process of me changing, they change as well. Or after I change a little bit or more, uh, either I discover a new, a new job or a new job discovers me. Either way, this is the best scenario.

[00:18:41] Simon Scriver: I mean, I, I’ve had some terrible bus buses in the past and I, I mean, I will say one thing I learned a lot.

[00:18:46] Simon Scriver: Like I learned a lot. That’s my positive. I have a great, I have a great bus these days and I have to say, um. I wanna, I wanna ask you then, in terms of trying to be a bit more positive in terms of what, what good looks like in, in your experience? Um, uh, with Ddo Ddo face-to-face training, that’s DIDO if anyone is looking for it.

[00:19:07] Simon Scriver: Um, and do follow Alin on, on LinkedIn. Alin’s vocal on link LinkedIn, so he is, he’s definitely worth follow. Um, but in the, in the organizations that you guys have worked with, what, what does a successful program look like? Like what is the structure of that? What’s. You know what signs of good,
uh, there are a few signs. The easiest from my perspective is when fundraisers and leaders enjoy coming to work. Another one is when people spend time outside of work. I think maybe this is one of the, the, the most confident signs that you have a good culture. People go out, have a beer, spend time, go partying, whatever, go fishing to each their own.
So this is one thing. And when it comes to the architecture, there are three elements that I discovered, really build a healthy culture. One is having regular team meetings. When you do team meetings. Regularly, either weekly, I, uh, I have a friend who’s doing them daily, but they’re shorter, maybe bimonthly, whatever works for you and for you, the format of your organization, what’s happening in, during the, the team meetings, if you facilitate them right then this helps, uh, fundraisers and people participating really bond.
Once they bond, it’s really, it becomes much more easier for you either to lead them wherever you want to lead them. I mean, achieving your goals, definitely. Or. Setting some healthy boundaries and. Development also happens during the team meetings if you are willing to train what the team needs right now.
And I’d like to discuss a little bit here because there’s that, uh, I’m sure most of the people looking at us right now, where in the future they know about the four stages of forming teams, which is forming. Storming, norming and performing. And anyway, there’s a journey as well. So a clever leader, I think a person who really wants to facilitate for the betterment of the team.
They look at their team, where the team is right now, either forming, storming, norming, or or performing, and they facilitate the team exactly with what they need, not what they think they need. I wouldn’t have, uh, to, I wouldn’t bring get, to, get to know exercises to a performing team because it would be boring.
Mm-hmm. At the same time, I wouldn’t bring, you know, high level trainings or high level skills or challenging people from. Like a forming stage with something that they don’t know. They don’t really know how everything works. They don’t know their roles in the team yet. There’s still a few stages that they need to, let’s say, conquer.
So this is one thing, and also the four elements that really make up a good team meeting is, are actually fun. We need people to have fun. You need people to grow. So facilitate something, bring something that they, they grow, uh, make sure. You set and review goals, this helps a lot. And one thing that I’m really proud of discovering, I call the minutes, minutes of virtue.
So I make sure that almost ev, I mean, everybody gets to hear their voice during the team meetings,

[00:22:27] Simon Scriver: and
I have 10 to 15 minutes a slot. Aimed exactly for people to vent. So really, and I have this, this structure, uh, nonviolent structure or LET, whatever, it’s something that I’ve developed, developed over the years and sometimes there’s a lot coming, you know, popping out.
We set for 15 minutes and we end up like, um. Venting for 45 minutes and sometimes we sit 14, uh, 10 to 15 minutes in silent silence. And I make sure to tell, to tell them that. I know that sometimes when you sit in silence, you might feel uncomfortable or cringe as we said, uh, a little bit in the beginning, but being able to sit in silence with someone and, you know, um, not taking out your phone or not, you know, think about something else.
Yeah. That. Increases the intimacy. Intimacy level.

[00:23:21] Simon Scriver: Yeah. So
I practically, it helps a lot. It helps with lowering the conflict levels, uh, or number of the conflicts of conflicts. And also it increases, you know, people being, becoming more comfortable with one another. I.

[00:23:35] Simon Scriver: Yeah, I think that, I think, I mean, I, I’m a man who loves to vent and I could do it most of the day, but I think, I think there is that, that notion that you, you know, meetings and stuff can get littered with venting and you, you find yourself just venting throughout it.

[00:23:47] Simon Scriver: So I actually really like the idea of creating a space for it to like, get it done. And like you said, there’ll be times where you realize. This isn’t worth bringing up. I’m just venting about it. ’cause it’s part of our conversation almost. But actually this isn’t really an issue. It’s just like, this is our job.

[00:24:02] Simon Scriver: This is something we’re working through. So I quite like that. Alin, you strike me as a man who en who gets up every morning and enjoys going to work. Do you enjoy your job?

[00:24:10] Alin Dinu: I really enjoy my job. I mean, I’ve done this when I work for Save the Children, I’ve done this. A little bit without being the, getting paid.
And even if I would win the lottery, I would still do work in face-to-face fundraising. It’s really my iki guy. I mean, uh, it’s all about communication. It’s about, uh, contributing, uh, people grow and yeah, it, I forgot the other element of eki. I, but definitely it’s, it’s, uh, ticks off all the elements.

[00:24:40] Simon Scriver: I love it.

[00:24:40] Simon Scriver: I love to see, I love to see a man who’s passionate about this job. How would your coworkers describe you? How would your business partner describe you?
Perseverant, first of all?

[00:24:49] Simon Scriver: Yeah.
This, this is one thing. Uh, I’m very resourceful. I mean, if you are working with me, definitely I’m finding solutions to whatever, like what the, the challenge, what challenges might appear.
Uh, I’m, some people would say I’m very communicative. I mean, not talkative, but you know. Uh, I think listening is my strong point.

[00:25:11] Simon Scriver: Hmm.
So when my friends, or my coworkers, or the people that I work with, uh, chat, most of them, I hope, you know, I’m not mistaken. I, I hope they feel understood. And this, like, I, I really, uh.
Beyond all of this, like beyond the fundraising and the growth and everything that we’re doing, I strive to really develop relationships, first of all.

[00:25:38] Simon Scriver: Mm-hmm. There’s a real skill in, in that, you know, in that listening, that building relationship, that empathy, do you know, which I think is, it serves people in face to face and, and fundraising general serves ’em very well.

[00:25:49] Simon Scriver: But it’s lacking in, uh, you know, in a lot of places. And sometimes it, it can be a real challenge, but it’s, it’s been such a pleasure chatting to you. So I’m gonna see you face to face in person at the International F two F Fundraising Congress, uh, which is happening in April in Vienna, uh, in Australia.

[00:26:05] Simon Scriver: You were there last time. You enjoy it? I was there. Yeah. I loved
it. Uh, a funny story, something very funny that happened last Congress. I came there, uh, I was really searching for a partner, uh, a partner that, someone that I would offer value, you know, I would be able to contribute with, uh, internationally.

[00:26:28] Simon Scriver: Yeah. And
there, like one of the workshops, uh, I met Jules there and we chatted a little bit out like, uh, in the hotel area. I shared a little, a little bit about who I am, you know, what I was doing, how I’m focusing on the process. He also shared about, you know, focusing on the process and trusting the process with his own clients that he had as a consultant back then.
So we ended up like. Connecting and also continuing to connect after the conference like once per week. And what began as a one or two hours, uh, short meetings every week, uh, ended up becoming a business that were working, uh, weekly and were having clients and were supporting and or developing, uh, materials.
And our dream is to really build. A digital platform where fundraisers and leaders have on demand training exactly for what they need based on micro learnings, which I think is one of the things that are. State-of-the-art and training right now?

[00:27:29] Simon Scriver: Yeah, well, I mean, I mean, I’m hearing a lot of echoes, so it’d be good to chat.

[00:27:32] Simon Scriver: ’cause I, I met my business partner Nikki, uh, at a conference years ago and we set up fundraising everywhere.com. Um, and so for anyone listening to watching this, you can find learnings online, uh, including our virtual face-to-face fund, ring fundraising conference, which is coming up on the 23rd of April.

[00:27:49] Simon Scriver: Um, so if you can’t make it in person to Vienna. For the International Congress, then the Fundraising Everywhere Conference is happening at the end of April too. Grab your tickets there. Um, go over to fundraising everywhere.com and you can see all of the events we’ve got coming up. But Alin, that’s it.

[00:28:03] Simon Scriver: Where can people find you? Where’s your social, social media of choice these days? Are you a LinkedIn man, guys?

[00:28:10] Alin Dinu: I’m a LinkedIn man. I also have a, uh, an Instagram, uh, account. It’s called the Face-to-Face Coach. Also, we have a website. Which is ddo face-to-face dot com, so, or ddo f two f.com where, uh, there’s a lot of resources. You can take some of, uh, leadership assessments or fundraising assessments. It’s very simple to use and also if you get on there, you might find something that you might be valuable.

[00:28:36] Simon Scriver: Amazing. Yeah, I do encourage people to check it out. Alin, so lovely to see you. Thank you for being on this. Really lovely to, to chat to you and to anyone watching.

[00:28:44] Simon Scriver: Uh, my name is Simon Scriver. I am the co-founder of Fundraising Everywhere. It’s been lovely talking to you Again. If you’re not already subscribed to the podcast or following us on LinkedIn, then please do. Um, and also head over to fundraising everwhere.com where you’ll find all of our events coming up, uh, including, as I said, the face-to-face fundraising conference happening in April.

[00:29:01] Simon Scriver: But that’s me, that’s Simon saying goodbye. Have a good day. I’m grateful to be here. Grateful to chat to you all. Uh, take care everyone.

[00:35:26] Alex Aggidis: Thank you so much for listening to the Fundraising Everywhere podcast. If you’re enjoying this podcast, why not share it with a fundraising friend? And if you would like to give us a little like or subscribe, it really helps more fundraisers like you find us.

[00:35:39] Alex Aggidis: Thank you so much. See you next time.

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